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Does (Broadcast Safe) filter order matter?
Hi guys,
I’ve been wondering this for some time and couldn’t find any posts on the subject, so here goes…
We’re color correcting / finishing an HD spot in FCP by using (and modifying) the Color Corrector filter, as well as adding a Broadcast Safe filter on top of it.
My question is, when I open the FILTERS tab, I see that FCP has placed the Broadcast Safe filter below the CC Filter.
Does this Filter order matter? And if so, is it better to have your Broadcast Safe Filter on TOP of the others?
Thanks in advance for any insight!
– Jennifer -
15 Replies
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Jennifer,
Turn on the FCP scopes and test for yourself by applying the filters in different order.
I’m not being mean, it’s just that you should see for yourself exactly what changing the order does. It’s really good to see it with your own eyes…
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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Hi David –
Thank you for your response. The scopes are of course on, and yes, we see the white levels jump a hair. But with the Broadcast Safe filter on either the TOP or BOTTOM position, the whites are still is within safety.
We were really just curious as to what the “standard” was – Does the Broadcast Safe filter usually go on the TOP or BOTTOM?
Thanks again for your response, though!
– Jennifer -
FCP renders the filters from top to bottom. Broadcast Safe should be the second to last filter and Levels should be last.
As a rule, I don’t apply either filter until I’m completely done with the project, then I simply Select All and apply them to all the clips at the same time.
here’s my recipe for ensuring true broadcast safe in any project.
https://www.biscardicreative.com/blog/?p=134
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” now in Post.
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
Perfect! Exactly what I was looking for – Thanks so much, Walter!
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[walter biscardi] “Broadcast Safe should be the second to last filter and Levels should be last. “
Walter,
I have never been sure exactly why you’re applying the Levels filter. Can you please elaborate? I have checked it out as thoroughly as possible with scopes, and it does nothing after I’m done doing my normal job of bringing everything into spec.
TIA,
DRWDavid Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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[David Roth Weiss] “I have checked it out as thoroughly as possible with scopes, and it does nothing after I’m done doing my normal job of bringing everything into spec.”
Clips the blacks and keeps them at 0.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” now in Post.
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
[Jennifer Jones] “We were really just curious as to what the “standard” was – Does the Broadcast Safe filter usually go on the TOP or BOTTOM?”
I agree with Walter, Broadcast Safe filter last — that assures that the output of the entire pipeline is being clamped at or slightly below broadcast spec.
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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[walter biscardi] “Clips the blacks and keeps them at 0.”
Which is the first thing I do, hence I can see no effect on stuff that’s I’ve already worked on. I can still see it as an extra safety measure though…
THNX
David Roth Weiss
Director/Editor/Colorist
David Weiss Productions, Inc.
Los AngelesPOST-PRODUCTION WITHOUT THE USUAL INSANITY ™
A forum host of Creative COW’s Apple Final Cut Pro, Business & Marketing, Indie Film & Documentary, and Film History & Appreciations forums.
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[David Roth Weiss] “Which is the first thing I do, hence I can see no effect on stuff that’s I’ve already worked on. I can still see it as an extra safety measure though…”
I generally run my blacks about -5 to -10 when color grading to really bring out the depth of a scene. If you run the Levels filter anyplace but last, it will not clip the blacks correctly at 0.
We discovered this about 5 years ago when we started doing Good Eats and could not figure out why the blacks kept dropping off even though I had the Levels Filter on. It was after I moved Levels to last we got the blacks to hold correctly.
Since then it’s been a matter of habit and other folks have told me it works best as the last filter in their tests as well.
Walter Biscardi, Jr.
Editor, Colorist, Director, Writer, Consultant, Author.
HD Post and Production
Biscardi Creative Media“Foul Water, Fiery Serpent” now in Post.
Creative Cow Forum Host:
Apple Final Cut Pro, Apple Motion, Apple Color, AJA Kona, Business & Marketing, Maxx Digital. -
I got sick and tired of the broadcast safe not being safe after render. I know Walters trick of adding levels may solve this but there is a free luma & chroma safe filter (Video Legaliser) available from https://www.thegradingsweet.com/w2/. Go to the online store and download the demo which includes the Legaliser which is free.
It works before and after render
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