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Multicamera improvements in FCP soon?
OK,
I realize this may come with backlash, and if I’m off base then I deserve it but here goes…
I love FCP. I think there is more long term future in FCP right now then in the AVID world. At some point I’m going to have to decide to move forward on a multi-camera project using FCP or AVID. I am in the scripted mulitcamera world and my heart wants me to go FCP but my gut tells me as a newer editor (in multicam) to go with AVID, because FCP for heavy duty multicamera editing because it requires more steps and time to prep at the assist level.
**I want to pause here for a second and say, if I were on a single camera project, it wouldn’t even be a debate for me, I would be using Final Cut pro****
I’m wondering if Apple/FCP are planning on making it’s multi camera interface competitive with AVID in the near future; here is a scenario/problem I will draw up for you.
I’m on a multicamera project. 4 cameras, all jam synched perfectly with Time of day TC
In the world of AVID, assuming I correctly label and name clips in some proper order, I could select a full bin of clips with varying cameras and multi-group them and with one click of the mouse have them grouped by time code in a multi-clip. Any time code breaks are met with black, but all cameras hold their positions in the viewer window as identified by clip names (ending in either A,B,C or 1,2,3). In the end I could have a full day for footage, A camera in the first window, D camera in the fourth window, holding their positions the whole way through “the day”, with no more than 4 windows in the multigroup all corresponding in sync by TC. This is perfect.
In the world FCP with the same scenario (selecting a folder/bin filled with clips), any time code break defaults the next clip into a NEW camera window, meaning EVERY quicktime clip results in a NEW multi-camera window window in the viewer. i.e. If I have 19 clips I have 19 windows, instead of those 19 clips sorting themselves by camera and falling into their respective (4) camera positions by T.O.D. timecode and clip name. Even if I assign numerically correct nomenclature for my clip name, fcp identifies each quicktime as a “new camera”. My only other option is to group new clips by EVERY SINGLE TC break. Turning a process equal to one mouse click in the AVID world to one that takes hours, days and sometimes weeks (depending on the scale of the project) in the world of FCP.
This is a major, major handicap, and one that stops editors from taking advantage of the affordability of an FCP system. Now, with AVID dropping it’s price last month, it’s going to make it harder for editors to take that leap of faith. It’s hard enough to get producers to make sure your material is jam synched, and when it is, (as it always should be) organizing the material should be a cinch. It’s a shame to me FCP does not have this worked out. I would think reality shows would benefit even moreso from this. You could have a day of footage in one clip with every camera at your fingertips!
My questions:
Does anyone of you guys know of way in FCP to group and multiclip your material without having to make a individual group for every time a camera cuts on every quicktime file?
I think if this was remedied, you’d have a faction of AVID editors feeling more comfortable moving over to fcp. This kink makes me very, very uneasy knowing an assist has to dedicate many extra hours to prepping material. In fact, it makes it hard for me to justify to a producer why I should be allowed to use an FCP system in the multicam world.
Also, not that I’m a big fan of it, but are there any plans in the works to have some sort of scripter/script based editing software in fcp down the line. This is a also something giving pause to AVID editors from converting to FCP!
Again, I hope I’m just missing something here, I just want this to work and make final cut better. I enjoy the interface/process of editing in the FCP world I think it is much much more of a natural feel. I hope this is not met with hostility, I’m not an AVID veteran who is resistant to change, I sincerely want to make this a better product.
DM
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10 Replies
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You’re post shouldn’t illicit ANY lashback IMHO… If anything, the opposite.
Have you tried selecting all your clips and creating a “multiclip sequence” instead? It might be just what you’re looking for. it’s made for the situtaion where cameras that have the TC match, but the cameras start and stop etc… If you search for this term in the online help manual, you”ll read more about it.
Jerry
Apple Certified Trainer
Author: “Jerry Hofmann on Final Cut Pro 4” Click here
Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D
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Thanks for the great response Jerry. Yes I have tried that. It’s interesting, and yeah it works technically, but I should not be pigeonholed into editing by subtraction from a sequence. The sequence becomes my clip, and this isn’t right and works against the traditional editorial process where you have source material on the left, and your recorded material on the right. If I want to assemble a cut from the viewer I should be able to do so. Any other ideas, I really don’t think this is something FCP can handle. I would love to show Apple how this issue really makes productions have to change too many basic processes to incorporate it in the multi-cam world.
To edit a sporting event with multiple cameras I must now adamantly insist to my camera operators DON’T STOP ROLLING EVER YOU’LL MAKE MORE WORK FOR ME WHEN I MULTICLIP. That’s the Apple software dictating the production process and that is not right.
DM
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I’ve never had an occasion to need to make a multiclip sequence. Lot’s of Multiclips, but not the sequence routine.
I’m unclear on your response though. If you make a multiclip sequence, it doesn’t work the same as a regular multiclip? i.e. you can switch from the Viewer?
Jerry
Apple Certified Trainer
Author: “Jerry Hofmann on Final Cut Pro 4” Click here
Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D
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P.S… anyone who knows what Apple’s up to can’t talk about it… those that do talk, don’t know.
I do know for a fact that Apple reads every single feedback form sent in… just write them up a feature request there. It’s found in the FCP menu…
Jerry
Apple Certified Trainer
Author: “Jerry Hofmann on Final Cut Pro 4” Click here
Dual 2 gig G5, AJA Kona SD, AJA Kona 2, Huge Systems Array UL3D
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Jerry thanks a lot, I will certainly write to them.
I know I’m being confusing so I will try to be clear. You asked if I’ve tried making a multi clip sequence. Yes I have. And it works. But it’s still a sequence. It is not a clip. I would prefer it if the sequence were a multi clip, with each camera holding it’s designated window regardless of any TC break. This would allow me to view my source material in the viewer window. Select ins and outs for whatever camera I’d like and then make an edit onto or into my sequence below.
Instead, with the “Multi clip sequence”, I am working by subtraction. Meaning I’m scanning through a sequence and deleting the material I do not want. That may work on some projects, but I need to know I can go the other way as I could on an AVID. Scanning through a multiclip in the viewer and then adding it to my sequence.
I can do this, but only after jumping through and over the many nonexistent black holes left by quicktime’s lack of recognition for TC breaks in corresponding cameras. I spend hours sewing together multiclips because I love editing from the viewer in FCP. Something AVID software calculates in literally one click.
I will absolutely write in. Thanks Jerry.
DM
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Dennis,
It sounds like you’re missing a fundamental grasp of the way that FCP creates multiclips out of sequences.
This from the p 251 of the manual (You did read it, yes?)The Make Multiclip Sequence command allows you to create multiple multiclips at the
same time. When you capture a lot of media files from a multicamera shoot, it can be
time-consuming to create multiclips one at a time using the Make Multiclip command.
When you need to make a lot of multiclips at the same time, you can use the Make
Multiclip Sequence command to create multiclips based on the starting timecode
numbers of your clips.
Consider the following example. Suppose you recorded a soccer game with four
camcorders (each starting with the same timecode), and you captured each reel as ten
individual media files (each representing a different phase of the event). The total
number of clips in your project is 40 (4 reels x 10 media files). Instead of creating each
of the ten multiclips individually, you can select all the clips at once and use the Make
Multiclip Sequence command. A sequence containing ten multiclips is created and the
multiclips are placed in chronological order.
This sounds like exactly what you’re trying to accomplish.
We just completed a 2 hour, 6 cam special for MTV using exactly this method of creating multiclips from “TOD” based cameras that started and stopped all the time. This shoot also included “dual system” audio from BWFs recorded separately.
mark
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One warning. You cannot use Color if you create multiclips. It just won’t work.
Even if you uncollapse them, copy and paste the clips into a new sequence in a new project, it still remembers they used to be multiclips and will not work properly with Color.
Sean
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Sean,
A work around for this (definitely a PITA) is to matchframe each clip back to it’s ORIGINAL source and overcut it back into the sequence. Then, both media manager and color will perform as expected. If you don’t do this, then MM may not “shed” the unused media, requiring you to digitize hours of extra media.
mark
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[Mark Raudonis] “This sounds like exactly what you’re trying to accomplish.
“He also wants to have these multiclips in the Viewers to scrub and edit from there to the timeline. I guess dragging the multisequence to the Viewer and hitting Command-F10 instead of F10 should do that, though I can’t check it right now,
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I don’t know if this helps or not but I’ll try. We recut all of our stuff in multicam with 20 different clips with TC from 4 cameras plus the line cut. We put all the clips into a bin then select the first 4 cameras plus the Line Cut and edit, once a clip from a camera is finished we just grab the next clip from that same camera and add it to the multicam by clicking “Command and the clip and drag it over the viewer and add it to the multiclip. You can then click the old clip and pull it out of the viewer and throw it away and keep on editing without having 19 different cameras.
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