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Obsolete Mac Pro VS Windows PC – What should I expect?
OK, I ordered a pretty fast PC from Amazon, kind of a no-name gaming PC but it had great specs, i7 3930 Six Core at 3.2 ghz.
Installed a Nvidia GTX 670, did the supported cards text file hack, and Premiere Pro 5.5 on it, along with Quicktime Pro, and fonts I needed. I also installed a nifty program called X-Mouse which allowed me to customize my logitech scrolling mouse to use Premiere Pro as I also using USB Overdrive on my Mac – indispensable software.
Got a KVM so I could use my 2 large displays currently hooked up to my Mac on the PC without totally disabling my Mac Pro 2008 8 core – it is my workhorse and I use it all the time.
Finally got the PC somewhat functional on with Premiere Pro and even got it working with projects and media via a fast network connection. It seemed like butter vs my old Mac Pro. My lack of being a Windows power user I’m sure was responsible for my ultimate failure at getting my Windows system, but there could be hardware issues with this particular PC as well. Ultimately it was a total pain to share projects and media that resided on my Mac. Using Premiere Pro on the PC was identical in many ways to the Mac, just faster.
However the PC started going downhill pretty much as I got it working. It wouldn’t properly reboot, always spinning in the ‘Shutting Down’ screen. I had to hard restart it all the time.
Then things started to go south, probably due to system corruption from having to hard reset it. I installed a fresh OS on the other internal drive in hopes it would fix the problems, a whole new set of software to get Premiere Pro working well. Again, shutdown hangs, without any diagnostics other than windows coming up at the hard restart saying there was a problem with the previous shutdown, and wiping out a lot of stuff each time. Then in hopes of curing the ills, a reformat of the drives, reinstallation of Windows 7 Pro, and then the ability to actually install the OS. 2 reformatted drives that cannot b installed with OS. Epic failure. The replacement is on the way.
But this being said, the amount of time in order to make this environment ‘cross platform’ as well as the indiocyncracies of Windows (to me, I’m not bashing Windows – it seems to be a fine OS!) makes me rethinking the PC for Premiere Pro switch.
I realize the current Mac Pros are basically obsolete, however, MY Mac Pro really is, it’s from 2008 and not the fastest model from that era (2.8ghz 8 core, non threading Xeon.)
Investigating “new” Mac Pros, I can get a 6 Core 3.3 ghz threading Mac Pro plus 32GB of RAM for about $3,500. I can get a 12 Core 3.09 ghz for $6,700 and a refurb 2.93ghz with 32GB for about $5,700. The Windows PC with everything I need is in the $4K range. I don’t need any new peripherals to make it a direct replacement for my current Mac Pro, all PCI, peripherals will just work. I’m familiar with the OS, and all my apps and plugins will work, no KVM necessary, no cross platform issues. Just not as cost effective as the PC and perhaps slower.
However…
Disregarding the cost, my time is valuable and I probably spend a good 3 solid days getting something non functional to work. There will be continual inefficiencies because I’m not a Windows shop, and I don’t foresee this.
Will any ‘new’ Mac Pro, regardless of the cost, get me to the speed using Premiere Pro of this 6 core 3.2ghz i7 3930K? If I get the answer that the Mac 12 core will get me there, it may be a viable option. If the 6 core will get me 80% there, it might be the ‘best buy’ option.
Thanks for any advice, really!
-Keith
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29 Replies
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Purely on CPU power, i7-3930K is about 35% faster than the fastest 6-core single Xeon used in Mac Pros (w3680). This isn’t the whole story, given Xeon’s access to larger memory pools, additional instructions and features.
Depending on how many hours a day your system spends at 100% CPU load, a single CPU Mac Pro may or may not be a “good enough” substitute for an i7-3930K Windows system. If it’s less than two-three hours then it most likely is “good enough”.
Another option is to get a Windows system with reputable support so that if it does experience problems, they will be quickly addressed. It’ll likely cost $1K or more on top of the cost of components. Possibly worthwhile given the cost of downtime and trouble-shooting?
Alex Gerulaitis
Systems Integrator
DV411 – Los Angeles, CA -
For Mac to PC switchers, it seems a lot of folks have been turning to the HP Z820 line. Including us…
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Yes, that seems like one of the top choices for switchers, but, what if I don’t want to switch but ‘upgrade’ my aging 2008 to a 2010? Will I get something that I can scrub a few layers of AVCHD acceptably well or will it be the sluggish, somewhat frustrating experience I now have with my 2008 Mac Pro 8 Core?
That’s really my question. I do realize that without any other factors, PC is THE WAY to go for price /vs performance. But what about just performance and accepting that the Mac Pro isn’t a very good deal. Will I be happy with a “new” Mac Pro?
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Thats a rhetorical question since no one know any info on the new Mac Pro 😀
I went for the Z820 with the fastest processors available. After a 27% price reduction on the unit, a price reduction on the warranty and free next day delivery, I think I got a good deal.
It will be a major step up from my early 2008 Mac Pro from what my research indicates.
Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com
Mac Pro 3,1
8 core
10.7.3
Nvidia Quadro 4000
24 gigs ram
Maxx Digital / Areca 8tb. raid
Kona 3 -
Hey Tom, I’m curious what specs you chose for the z820 (memory and graphics card)? Do you think there is a large performance improvement from the NVIDIA Quadro 2000 and the 400?
Cody Walters
JW Studio LLC
Houston Video Production
Houston Wedding VideographerFinal Cut Studio 3
Adobe CS5 Master Suite
Panasonic HVX-200
Canon 7D -
I guess I’m going to try to bring this thread back to my original question, which may have been buried in my own verbosity in the original post. Perhaps I’ll do this more directly, please respond if you are:
1) Editors that have both Mac Pro 2010 / 2012 and 3930K i7 6 core PC’s
2) Editors that have the newest Mac Pro, either 12 Core 2.93ghz or 3.09 ghz, or 6 core 3.33ghz AND a 3930 i7 6 core at 3.3ghz or higher Windows PCNow that the parameters have been set:
Is either Mac Pro slower or faster than your Windows i7 when playing AVCHD footage in single or multiple layers? Please try to quantify it. I’m not necessarily looking for the ultimate speed demon, I’m must seeing if replacing my aging Mac Pro 2008 with a 2010/2012 model is even worth considering.
Thanks so much!
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Hi Cody. I got the fastest processors (2687W), and will probably use the Nvidia GTX 570 because it is faster then the Quadro series and better bang for the buck.
Sorry, Im not familiar with the Q600 or 2000.
Here is some info about GPUs …https://www.liftgammagain.com/forum/index.php?threads/cuda-performance-tests.321/
Tom Daigon
PrP / After Effects Editor
http://www.hdshotsandcuts.com
Mac Pro 3,1
8 core
10.7.3
Nvidia Quadro 4000
24 gigs ram
Maxx Digital / Areca 8tb. raid
Kona 3 -
[Alex Gerulaitis] “Another option is to get a Windows system with reputable support so that if it does experience problems, they will be quickly addressed. It’ll likely cost $1K or more on top of the cost of components. Possibly worthwhile given the cost of downtime and trouble-shooting?”
Agreed.
I don’t believe that cost efficiency is the reason to switch to PC, as buying a configured workstation from a real workstation vendor or VAR will cost just as much as a Mac. The advantages are that you can buy better performance on the PC side, and you can buy better support (on-site technician visits!) than is available from Apple.
[Keith Moreau] “Perhaps I’ll do this more directly, please respond if you are:
1) Editors that have both Mac Pro 2010 / 2012 and 3930K i7 6 core PC’s
2) Editors that have the newest Mac Pro, either 12 Core 2.93ghz or 3.09 ghz, or 6 core 3.33ghz AND a 3930 i7 6 core at 3.3ghz or higher Windows PC”Keith, I think you’ll have trouble finding someone with that experience here — and especially with this subject line.
I’d advise you to perhaps start a new subject with “2010/2012 Mac Pro AVCHD Performance?” in the title to attract folks who may have that machine.
Good luck — and I’m pretty curious to know the answer myself.
Walter Soyka
Principal & Designer at Keen Live
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
RenderBreak Blog – What I’m thinking when my workstation’s thinking
Creative Cow Forum Host: Live & Stage Events -
Keith, the problem you are having often shows up in ‘no name clones’. Some work great, some are crap. It’s often about compatibility of bios and the diligence done by companies to keep up with it. Blue screens of death, instability etc, often are not the fault of Windows per se, but the underlying hardware. (not always true though, but usually). While you have had a bad experience, I and others routinely run Pr 5.5 and 6 on Windows 7 64 bit, on name brand hardware from both Lenovo (laptop), HP (prior hardware) and Dell (desktop). The issues you might be facing could have to do with the BIOS that gets upgraded by these folks, along with drivers. BIOS and other compatability testing is not a simple task. Those companies have teams inside Microsoft to work on identifying issues with BIOS.
Beyond that, some drivers for certain cards, like nVidia, can have their own problems.It could also be that some of this is caused by your anti virus software. I’ve seen terrible problems id’ed to using Norton, for example. I (and others like Windows Secrets Labs) have found that MSFTs Security Essentials, seems to be the least problematic way of protecting your software.
It’s the price you pay to Apple to not have these problems, (even though they sometimes have other issues) which is one reason why they are more expensive. As you get name brand workstations, the prices rise to Apple like prices. At the high end, the choice is not so much price, but whether you prefer the Mac OS to Windows.
If you want to stay with Windows 64, then I would seriously recommend you sell off this gaming machine, and buy a workstation from any of those companies above. All provide great machines that will work with Premiere. My wife constantly reminds me to buy the best tool, not just the cheapest.
But if you really want to go back to the Mac, the choices are limited and expensive, but do work pretty well. Except when OS’s change, and they abandon professional users like us for upgraded consumer editing software (G).
Al
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One other thing. To simply answer your question directly, I have not seen tests between the current Mac Pros and I7 Windows 64 as to which is faster, on a totally identical kind of box. My Mac Pro (like yours) is older, and so my newer I7 is much faster on rendering with Adobe.
Al
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