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Garchow calls Creative Cloud Creative Suite by another name.
Long thread on the nature of CC dev – off that there was a post from Alex 4D I wanted to dredge up – it outlines just how far adobe went to town in one 12 month period with PPRO operating outside a sale cycle.
just scanning through – adobe anywhere – totally new re-linking architecture -closed captioning – new track patching – avid style nested sequences – through edits – LUTS – it goes on for yards –
and that nevermind 2014-15. To say that adobe are largely operating as a facsimile of a CS release model is not fair to the engineers involved in that list at all. I made a joke that my 600 quid should go for their engineer staff party – but come on seriously Jeremy. Premiere’s been on a rip the like of which I’ve personally never seen in twenty years.
Mollinaire paint through discreet effect to combustion was fun but this is off the scale. You could say, or I maybe I would like to say, that adobe are only doing this to load us onto the subscriber beast train del muerte to the promised land in 2019 where the board are waiting with open arms once we’re all locked in – but in the meantime those engineers are producing something utterly different to a CS schedule. Sure for all we know – they’re on their own beast train even. Still – Premiere Pro 2013-2015 dev deserves real respect?https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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22 Replies
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There’s no question that I deserve to be called out. I made a few remarks, and then subsequently furthered my opinion through the discussion, and perhaps that came through as disrespectful.
That was not my intent.
I’d like to point out, that I was, for the most part, talking specifically about the number one feature request of After Effects. The number one, as evidenced by what I found to be a rather cajoling blog post, even back when it was written in 2013. Perhaps, I need a break.
I also noted, that Adobe has proven what can be achieved with Creative Cloud. I gave credit where credit is due. I acknowledged the accelerated development. I even said that it feels like all the other apps got a whole lot of love, while Ae was floundering around with a cache system left over from the 90s.
Also, “CC 7.0” should have been called CC 2013. That would have set the tone. It would have let everyone know what to realistically expect out of this “new” development cycle.
Pr one the other hand, has come an amazingly long way in a short time. But it’s still Pr. There are ever more bolt on features, and that is my long standing issue with Adobe.
The Adobe engineers, and I say this over and over, do absolutely amazing work. Building and modifying complicated software while dragging a 20+ year legacy is no small feat. The engineers do deserve respect, and I didn’t mean to insinuate otherwise.
I’m a paying customer. I, too, have opinions. It’s OK to question the motivations (and communications, and marketing) today, as you did very early on. I’m happy Pr now has join through edits and keeping sync with third party SDI cards as of December, 2013. CC has allowed Adobe to address issues like that whenever they can slot it in, but I was hoping for a little more actual new features to reduce all the clicking. Even the new color panel needs to have two panels open to get the most control out of that one effect. That’s just weird science to me. Perhaps I’m expecting too much and need to change my frame of reference.
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I know this is the internet and we all have a soap box to stand on but for me if it doesnt work then my thoughts will be just that…Premiere doesnt work for me at the moment. Should I bother to see if CC 2015 fixes my issues?
Well if push comes to shove then I guess Ill have to but for now, I just need it to work for what my intentions are and it still doesnt with CC 2104. -
[Eric Santiago] “Premiere doesnt work for me at the moment. Should I bother to see if CC 2015 fixes my issues?”
But wait. Aren’t your issues with Premiere Pro largely due to trying to move complete productions between different NLEs? That’s difficult under nearly every circumstance. In any case, if you don’t like CC2014, then I’m afraid CC2015 won’t change your mind.
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
[Oliver Peters] “But wait. Aren’t your issues with Premiere Pro largely due to trying to move complete productions between different NLEs? That’s difficult under nearly every circumstance. In any case, if you don’t like CC2014, then I’m afraid CC2015 won’t change your mind.”
Partly yes but there are other options not quite there for myself.
I was hoping some of them would be answered in CC 2105.
I will wait it out till the smoke clears.
Im reading enough in the Premiere forum to keep me away for now. -
[Eric Santiago] “Partly yes but there are other options not quite there for myself.”
Such as?
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com -
[Jeremy Garchow] “There’s no question that I deserve to be called out.”
Hey no – just made me think alex4D’s thing. I just threw your name in the title for sensationalism…
[Jeremy Garchow] “It’s OK to question the motivations (and communications, and marketing) today, as you did very early on.”
Well, you know, I did just allude to the beast train to mexico in my post there – that’s not unqualified optimism about the subscription long term picture wha??
[Jeremy Garchow] “new features to reduce all the clicking. “
I wonder about this notion really if I’m honest. Is reducing clicking code for ‘where’s the magnetic timeline type stuff? You know what has lots of clicking? Maya. Or excel, or cinema 4D, or any complex comprehensive professional software really… Not wanting to drag this back to X – but isn’t that an unusually mouse driven editor? People do say that, and I’ve found it so for the amount I’ve used it. Stuff like conditional shortcuts where the same keys can do different stuff depending on whether you’re trimming or not trimming – Scott Simmons made a point of that in his premiere review – he viewed stuff like that as deeply rational, but I’m pretty sure it would confuse the hell out of a casual user. Premiere is radically more streamlined relative to where it was in v 5.5. The GUI has gone through three full rounds of refinement. That’s a lot of what I feel is clean about premiere at this point. Also it has the most reconfigurable interface of any editing system – bar none. And by a country mile too…
I get that the right click menus have gotten.. rather long in some instances, but have you ever right clicked in maya? IT’S BONKERS.
things could be worse like… I know X is a lot cleaner maybe, although i think it’s debatable really, I just don’t like all the compromises involved in getting it to look that nice and simple on top?
https://vimeo.com/user1590967/videos http://www.ogallchoir.net promo producer/editor.grading/motion graphics
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[Oliver Peters] “Such as?”
At the moment the whole RED file system is keeping me from even trying harder.
When I couldnt get the RED files in via import as oppose to the Media Browser that felt a little cumbersome.
Then after loading the first day of a 100 clips and attempting Merge with Audio (sound not tc), I got a little annoyed at that point.
Now Premiere has been in my tool kit since 1994.
I know the basics and they all match with the current NLEs.
But of late I just lose patience when I cant do the same workflow as FCPX.
Maybe its old age 🙂 -
Thanks Aindreas for bringing up the Marking Menus from Maya 🙂
In the past Ive brought that up with Adobe and have asked numerous times to steal it.
I love that option in Maya and hopefully someone writes an OS plug-in that can be utilized on all apps 🙂 -
[Eric Santiago] “When I couldnt get the RED files in via import as oppose to the Media Browser that felt a little cumbersome.”
Media Browser is meant specifically to do what OS-based file dialogs cannot: represent complex media folders as media clips instead of whatever sets of visible files (XML, spanned files, etc.) make up those clips.
That said, I think the Media Browser UX is a bit lacking, too. What specifically is it you don’t like about Media Browser that makes you want to reach for Import instead?
Walter Soyka
Designer & Mad Scientist at Keen Live [link]
Motion Graphics, Widescreen Events, Presentation Design, and Consulting
@keenlive | RenderBreak [blog] | Profile [LinkedIn] -
[Eric Santiago] “When I couldnt get the RED files in via import as oppose to the Media Browser that felt a little cumbersome.”
The MB is doing the same thing that the FCP X import module or Avid’s AMA is doing. This is where the camera-file-specific development is going, as it understands the different folder structures used by RED, Panasonic, Canon, Sony, etc. This is very important when it comes to spanned clips.
[Eric Santiago] “Then after loading the first day of a 100 clips and attempting Merge with Audio (sound not tc), I got a little annoyed at that point.”
That would be painful in FCP X, too. From my experience, you would actually be able to sync faster (and often more accurately) using a clap and manual syncing in either app.
[Eric Santiago] “But of late I just lose patience when I cant do the same workflow as FCPX.”
Well, the RED workflow in X is nice, but can create its own issues when you have to roundtrip. I would still advocate generating your own transcoded “masters” or editing proxies in Redcine-X Pro or Resolve and then relinking at the end if you want to. You might also have better luck (faster) syncing to transcoded masters or proxies than to the RED files.
Ultimately none of this sounds like an issue with Premiere as much as that you are simply liking the workflow in X better. Perfectly fine and understandable, but not really a deficiency in Premiere or a sign of lack of development by Adobe (not that you meant it to be such).
– Oliver
Oliver Peters Post Production Services, LLC
Orlando, FL
http://www.oliverpeters.com
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