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hdx900 for film out
1080@23.98p (not pA – so standard pull down) or 720@23.98p?
thoughts:
imager is 1280×720
the DVCPRO HD codec stores: 1080i@1280×1080; 720p@960×720
(I think) 1080@23.98p (not pA) is stored as psf – so in 1080@59.94i on tape
720@23.98p is stored in 720@60p (with duplicate frames) on tapeI’m tending to 1080 and I would go pA (advanced cadence) but the guys doing the online and color timing want standard pull down. I don’t think this is a quality issue and PLEASE correct me if I’m wrong on this.
This is a quote from June 3rd, 2005 so maybe a little outdated, but I can’t make sense of it:
“… A couple of reasons NOT to use 1080 24psf for filmouts –720p is a truly progressive format, while the 1080psf format is actually 2 progressive frames that melded back into a single frame (called Progressive Segmented Frames), and in content with high motion that can result with an “interlaced look” even though the content is progressive. …”
The poster could not have meant the judder frames, could he?Thnx,
Aram -
4 Replies
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RE:
I’m tending to 1080 and I would go pA (advanced cadence) but the guys doing the online and color timing want standard pull down. I don’t think this is a quality issue and PLEASE correct me if I’m wrong on this.
This is a quote from June 3rd, 2005 so maybe a little outdated, but I can’t make sense of it:
“… A couple of reasons NOT to use 1080 24psf for filmouts –720p is a truly progressive format, while the 1080psf format is actually 2 progressive frames that melded back into a single frame (called Progressive Segmented Frames), and in content with high motion that can result with an “interlaced look” even though the content is progressive. …”
The poster could not have meant the judder frames, could he?Thnx,
Aram
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Hi Aram:
I
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Thank you Steve.
“…The process does not introduce any artifacts so long as the single imaged frame is processed as such, if for some reason one half of the PSF is processed separately problems can arise…”
That was/is my understanding as well, hence me saying: “The poster could not have meant the (incorrect handling of the) judder frames, could he?”
Well, it seems that the production decided to go 720p23.98. I know this is not a bad choice, and FCP 5.1.4 will be able to capture native over FireWire.
I am wondering if there is a cleaner signal/image when going 1080 rather than 720?
I would test for myself, but have no access to the camera till later.
Thanx again,
Aram -
Hi Aram;
With respect to 1080 vs 720p, there is a slight difference, 1080p has more resolution. BUT if you shoot film style, 24p and turn off the detail enhancement, the difference is really minimized. Shoot a test, compare it for yourself but use good glass (primes) and a good monitor…. it’s your choice, the good news is that the camera shoots both.
Good luck,
Steve
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Hi Steve,
I came across this thread when I was trying to do research in order to solve a problem I am having. Here’s the breakdown:
1. I directed a commercial which was shot on the Hvx and firestore fs-100. The dp said he shot in 1080 and 24fps. Also, he had the footage recorded into quiktimes instead of P2.
2. I am editing the footage, and have had some experience with pulldown removals. I imported the footage into the Last version of FCP before the new FCP studio 2, which just came out. The footage was in the 108060i DVC ProHD codec @ 29.97 for the frame rate. There was no option to reverse telecine (2:3 pulldown) the footage in FCP or Cinema Tools. So, I assumed that the Footage was shot using the 1080/24pA mode, which uses the advanced pulldown (2:3:3:2) And sure enough final cut would remove the advance pull down making the footage 23.98 (Cinema Tools, however, had no options)
3. Upon examining the closer 23.98 footage, I noticed a problem. There was still interlacing.
4. I have now compared the original 29.97 footage and the advanced removed 23.98. The 29.97 has three frames of progessive then two interlaced frames. 23.98 has a cadence of three progressive frames, then one interlaced.
Conclusion: The DP nor myself knows whether he shot in the 1080p (24 over 60i) hvx mode or the 1080/24pA mode (24 with advance pulldown over 60i). Do you have any suggestions?
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