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24pn workflow with FCP
Just want to make sure I’m doing things correctly…we shot lots of 720p 24pn footage last week and I’m now editing the footage in Final Cut Pro. I’m combining this HD footage with previously shot footage that is 29.97, so I’ve just been editing in the SD 29.97 timeline and rendering the 24pn shots as I go. The footage looks great but the 3:2 pulldown is jerkier than what I normally see from film transfers or footage shot with 24p/29.92 framerate.
So my question is, should I process all the 24p native footage with Cinema Tools before finishing the project in Final Cut Pro? Will this do a better conversion to 29.97 fps than rendering in the timeline in FCP? I’ve never used Cinema Tools but I’ve started reading the manual and it seems I can add 3:2 pulldown and convert the footage pretty quickly with it. Just wondering if this is the right way to work, or is there a better way?
Appreciate any tips/tricks. Sorry if this question has been addressed before; if so I couldn’t find the thread.
Joe Murray
http://www.editatjoes.com -
8 Replies
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Why did you shoot 24pn if you knew you were going to be cutting it into a 29.97 SD project? Why didn’t you shoot the same format that already existed? That camera shoots 81 different formats.
I am not sure about Cinema Tools, but you can look at Compressor and go into the ADVANCED settings. Choose the format you are working with and see if that works.
Shane
Littlefrog Post
http://www.lfhd.net -
It would be better to process the 24 to 29.97 in something like Shake. It is worth the $500 for just retiming alone. While you’re at it use Shake to slow down a clip and you will never do it in FCP again. I’m in no way a Shake guy but even I can do this type of stuff.
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This is the issue with 24p, if you want to go to standard frame rate, then your going to get stuttering. Take the 60i footage down to 24p using Cinema Tools, edit. Output to DVD progressive playback and this is not an issue with 24p.
I have NOT been able to get a decent, seamless transfer of 24p to 60i with motion in the frame, anyone with any ideas?
Regards
Steve -
>>>Why did you shoot 24pn if you knew you were going to be cutting it into a 29.97 SD project? Why didn’t you shoot the same format that already existed? That camera shoots 81 different formats.
I’m aware of the formats the camera shoots. Why shoot 24pn?
1. Storage space on P2 and P2 store
2. Had to render down to SD anyway
3. Adding pulldown to 24 frame footage is not a new or difficult technique
4. Have tested this on other projects and it works
5. For effects shots or graphics comps, easier to deal with progressive rather than interlaced footage with pulldown
6. Again, storage space on P2 and P2 store
So this time the only difference is a few shots that have more camera motion than in the previous test projects. The client hasn’t even said anything about the pulldown issue, but I know it could be better and want to get some ideas on how to improve certain shots.
Joe Murray
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Is there something that Shake does that After Effects, Combustion or Twixtor can not do? All these programs can deal with frame rate conversions pretty well.
I used to add pulldown all the time working on a Discreet Smoke system and it was incredibly fast and easy. I know I can do this with any of these desktop graphics programs as well, all of which I have except Shake. I’ll do a test and report back.
Joe Murray
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By suggesting Shake I was not saying it could not be done in other graghic programs, I just would not except good results doing it in FCP. This is even more important if you go from 30i to 24P, then I would suggest Shake or Magic Bullet for that. Oh course try the software you have first.
I’m still not sure why you choice to shoot 24P, even a good pull down is going to look different than 29.97 unless you were going for a marked different look in the footage. You could have shoot 480i DVCPro50 at 29.97 and got even more footage on the P2 card.
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I just rendered pulldown with After Effects and it does look much better. It’s not that I want this new footage to look like the old, I want it to look better, more filmic, so the new footage accomplishes that. And actually shooting DVCPro 50 uses up more P2 and drive space than 720p 24pn. 8G card gives you 20 minutes at 720p 24pn and only 15-16 minutes on DVCPro50.
Joe Murray
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i just read up on cinema tools! Thanks for the creative spark. I am in a similar boat since much of my footage is a hodgepodge going back several years, including miniDV, DVCPRO HD, Kodak 5218 transferred to Beta. Apple is pitching cinema tools as a “film out” product, but I think you’re onto something. Thanks again.
RH
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